Thinking about the Pence thing - something makes sense. The envelopes that the anthrax was maile in were purchased from a vending machine in a post office. The envelopes had certain subtle defects. Other envelopes with the same defects were sent to two post offices in VA, and one in Elkton, MD.
Elkton MD, incidentally is about 2 hours drive from Frederick. It is very near the border of MD/DE. It is NOT on the path from Frederick to Newark, although it is on the path from DC and points south (I-95). It is ALSO on the path from Florida to New York. Florida being the state where the terrorists were supposedly based in the US.
Anyway.. back to the envelopes - they are sold in packages of 5. Although only 2 envelopes were recovered from the initial mailing, which went out on 9/18/01, by following the trail of anthrax infections there is pretty compelling evidence that 5 letters were sent out.
The known letters in the first batch letters were sent to NBC (Tom Brokaw) and the NY Post newspaper. The other three are thought to have been mailed to ABC, CBS and American Media.
The second batch has only ever been mentioned as two envelopes. One to Leahy and one to Daschle. That leaves three extra (unknown) envelopes. And three additional politicians with trace amounts of anthrax found in their office.
So, what does this mean? I have no clue. But I do wonder why the other 3 were sort of swept under the rug?
One thing that I thought of while writing this, is the proximity of Elkton to Ft. Detrick and Trenton NJ. As I said above, it is not on the "normal" path. I do not believe that the killer would have stopped and picked up envelopes on the way to drop off the anthrax. The envelopes had to have been acquired before that. If nothing else, so the mailer could address them in that block printing. Plus, anyone with any familiarity with anthrax would not be carrying it around in their pocket till they got an envelope for it. PLUS it would be risky to do just before the drop time.
So the big question is - why Elkton? And why Princeton? What was the draw?
Here's another thing. Newark is enroute to NY. This guy made at least 2 trips from "wherever" to Newark. Maybe he travels from "wherever" to NY? Maybe he travels it often enough that no one would be suspicious of his travel? That is assuming of course, that the mailer is a legitimately employed person. The other possibility is that the person was a terrorist driving up whenever he felt like, from Florida to NY
Could it be someone who drives from say DC to NY rather frequently, who just hopped off the interstate in Elkton and found a post office and grabbed 2 stacks of envelopes. Then later (days? weeks?) he travelled again and jumped off the interstate again, found a nice mailbox box (In Princeton NJ) and dropped the letters? That would make more sense than someone from Frederick just randomly driving to Elkton to grab envelopes, then heading home. Then later driving up to Princeton on a totally different road, to drop the letters off.
One other thing (again) It just occurred to me that there was a three week gap between the mailings. Something is wrong with that. Why would the mailer have gone back to the same mailbox? He must have been worried that the authorities had figured it out and were keeping quiet about it - maybe watching the mailbox. (Certainly a paranoid person like Ivins would be thinking that.) I sure as heck would not have gone anywhere NEAR that box after the first letters were mailed. So - did the second letters go in that box? Or was it a different box? Or did the mailer have some way to know that it was safe to drop those envelopes in that box?
As with all the questions - who knows?
((disclaimer: I don't know why this case has suddenly caught my interest. I love a good mystery, but I barely paid any attention to it when it happened. Anyway, if the FBI or NSA or anyone else happens to stumble across this - I am not obsessive, I am not homicidal or psychotic. I am just a person who finds this interesting. Oh, and I really don't have anything against what ya'll do. Even though I think you messed this investigation up pretty bad - I don't think it was done with malice.))
Sunday, August 10, 2008
Pence - take 2!
OH HO!!! Pence is pro-life! http://www.ontheissues.org/IN/Mike_Pence_Abortion.htm
Holt - 100% pro-choice http://www.ontheissues.org/Social/Rush_Holt_Abortion.htm
Baldacci is interesting - He used to be Republican, then switched to Dem. I remember that, but I don't remember much else. Anyway - he seems pro-choice but not strongly. http://ontheissues.org/Governor/John_Baldacci_Abortion.htm
OK so that breaks the pro-life maniac theory. Score one on the Ivins side.
Holt - 100% pro-choice http://www.ontheissues.org/Social/Rush_Holt_Abortion.htm
Baldacci is interesting - He used to be Republican, then switched to Dem. I remember that, but I don't remember much else. Anyway - he seems pro-choice but not strongly. http://ontheissues.org/Governor/John_Baldacci_Abortion.htm
OK so that breaks the pro-life maniac theory. Score one on the Ivins side.
More old stuff - PENCE
Here is another old article. Who is Pence? Why do we never hear that trace amounts of anthrax were found in his office? He is not part of the "big 5", or the "second 2". Why not? Further investigation leads to this: http://edition.cnn.com/2001/HEALTH/conditions/10/27/anthrax.congress/index.html WASHINGTON (CNN) -- Investigators have found trace amounts of anthrax in three offices in the Longworth House Office Building, officials said Friday.
Why are these 3 never mentioned? Pence was a REPUBLICAN! Daschle and Leahy were democrats. The other two - Holt and Baldacci are also Dems. They couldn't include Holt and Baldacci without including Pence, but if they could, it would point the finger at a democrat hater, or a right-winger. So, is the opposite true? If our anthrax mailer targeted FIVE politicians, what is the connection? Is there one? That is a "motive" that has been given for Ivins. That he was anti-abortion and targeted Daschle and Leahy for being pro-choice. I wonder what Pences stand on abortion was?
anyway, here is a CNN interview with Pence from 10/2001
http://edition.cnn.com/2001/COMMUNITY/10/30/pence/
____________________________________________
By RICK YENCER The Star Press - Muncie, IN June 14, 2002
MUNCIE - Congressman Mike Pence believes the FBI should reconsider international terrorists as the source of anthrax mail attacks. "I am troubled by the apparent lack of progress in the FBI's current investigation," Pence wrote to U.S. Attorney General John Ashcroft this week.
In that letter, Pence also gave 10 examples of evidence pointing to international, not domestic, sources for anthrax letters that killed five people and closed Pence's office in the Longworth Building for nearly 2 months.
As a result of the letters, Pence, his family and staff took weeks of antibiotics as a precaution. None developed anthrax-like infections.
Last week, FBI Director Robert Mueller said the investigation had not produced any suspects. Pence said the FBI had apparently concluded the anthrax came from a domestic source instead of from al-Qaida operatives who also were responsible for airplane attacks on the World Trade Center and the Pentagon.
The congressman said the material found in his office and others on Capital Hill was weapons-grade anthrax that was genetically modified to increase its virulence.
DNA evidence showed the anthrax originated from the Ames strain that was developed at Fort Detrick, Md., and was later sent to a research facility in England.
In 1988, Iraqi germ warfare scientists attempted to obtain the Ames strain anthrax from England to create biological weapons. And the CIA has reported meetings between Al Qaeda members and Iraqi officials last year, Pence said.
"The FBI has spent most of its resources trying to find a mad scientist," Pence said. "The evidence points to Iraq."
Some 9-11 terrorists were treated for anthrax-type infections, he said.
Democratic congressional candidate Melina Fox said Hoosiers still worried about anthrax attacks, and like Pence, they wanted the people responsible identified and punished.
"We need a broader view than just the problems that touched one congressional office," she said.
Pence will meet with senior officials involved in the investigation next week.
Meanwhile, the Republican congressman gained a powerful position this week to help oversee the war on terrorism and create the new Department of Homeland Defense.
Pence was named to the House Judiciary Subcommittee on Crime, Terrorism and Homeland Security. The subcommittee will oversee all federal criminal matters relating to new terrorism policies.
"I hope to be a voice for the real world implications of certain terrorist attacks," Pence said.
Why are these 3 never mentioned? Pence was a REPUBLICAN! Daschle and Leahy were democrats. The other two - Holt and Baldacci are also Dems. They couldn't include Holt and Baldacci without including Pence, but if they could, it would point the finger at a democrat hater, or a right-winger. So, is the opposite true? If our anthrax mailer targeted FIVE politicians, what is the connection? Is there one? That is a "motive" that has been given for Ivins. That he was anti-abortion and targeted Daschle and Leahy for being pro-choice. I wonder what Pences stand on abortion was?
anyway, here is a CNN interview with Pence from 10/2001
http://edition.cnn.com/2001/COMMUNITY/10/30/pence/
____________________________________________
By RICK YENCER The Star Press - Muncie, IN June 14, 2002
MUNCIE - Congressman Mike Pence believes the FBI should reconsider international terrorists as the source of anthrax mail attacks. "I am troubled by the apparent lack of progress in the FBI's current investigation," Pence wrote to U.S. Attorney General John Ashcroft this week.
In that letter, Pence also gave 10 examples of evidence pointing to international, not domestic, sources for anthrax letters that killed five people and closed Pence's office in the Longworth Building for nearly 2 months.
As a result of the letters, Pence, his family and staff took weeks of antibiotics as a precaution. None developed anthrax-like infections.
Last week, FBI Director Robert Mueller said the investigation had not produced any suspects. Pence said the FBI had apparently concluded the anthrax came from a domestic source instead of from al-Qaida operatives who also were responsible for airplane attacks on the World Trade Center and the Pentagon.
The congressman said the material found in his office and others on Capital Hill was weapons-grade anthrax that was genetically modified to increase its virulence.
DNA evidence showed the anthrax originated from the Ames strain that was developed at Fort Detrick, Md., and was later sent to a research facility in England.
In 1988, Iraqi germ warfare scientists attempted to obtain the Ames strain anthrax from England to create biological weapons. And the CIA has reported meetings between Al Qaeda members and Iraqi officials last year, Pence said.
"The FBI has spent most of its resources trying to find a mad scientist," Pence said. "The evidence points to Iraq."
Some 9-11 terrorists were treated for anthrax-type infections, he said.
Democratic congressional candidate Melina Fox said Hoosiers still worried about anthrax attacks, and like Pence, they wanted the people responsible identified and punished.
"We need a broader view than just the problems that touched one congressional office," she said.
Pence will meet with senior officials involved in the investigation next week.
Meanwhile, the Republican congressman gained a powerful position this week to help oversee the war on terrorism and create the new Department of Homeland Defense.
Pence was named to the House Judiciary Subcommittee on Crime, Terrorism and Homeland Security. The subcommittee will oversee all federal criminal matters relating to new terrorism policies.
"I hope to be a voice for the real world implications of certain terrorist attacks," Pence said.
2001 National Journal article
Although the current sentiment is that the anthrax had to have come from Ft. Detrick, I think that it's worth looking at info from way back. I think that the FBI may have kept working on that assumption, and trying to find a suspect to fit with what they think they know. This article from 2001 lends some insight into other possible scenerios.
One other thing. When did info about the 9/11 terrorists start coming out? What I am getting at is the letter that was mailed to American Media in Fl. Everyone wonders why the mailer would have chosen that media outlet. The "common" thought is that it was to "frame" the terrorists. But the letters went out a week to the day after 9/11. So the mailer, in order to frame them, would have had to know where they were from, and then researched what media source was closest. Did he have 6 days to do it? Or 2 days? Or was the info not even public a week after 9/11? Was it sheer coincidence that the anthrax mailer chose to send letters to the BIG news outlets, and the company that spits out tabloid rags? If the mailer wanted to hit the tabloid audience, why didn't he send the letter directly to the National Enquirer?
Note: I started to highlight the relevant parts, and it is ALL relevant!
__________________________
Does Al Qaeda Have Anthrax? Better Assume So
National Journal, June 1, 2002
By Jonathan Rauch
The operatives and allies of Al Qaeda have something in mind for the United States, of that there can be little doubt. Something nasty. Vice President Dick Cheney said in May it is "almost certain" that the terrorists will strike again. Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld warned that terrorists "inevitably" will get their hands on weapons of mass destruction, "and they would not hesitate one minute to use them." Question: What if they already did use them and are preparing to do so again? Were last year's anthrax attacks, which caused five fatalities, a preview?
No one knows, of course. That said, there are dots worth connecting.
The perpetrator(s). In November, the FBI issued a suspect profile identifying the likely anthrax attacker as a single adult male, probably an American with a scientific background, lab experience, poor social skills, and a grudge. Some people -- I was one of them -- viewed this interpretation with skepticism. What would be the motive? Why the timing so close to September 11? A number of analysts, including David Tell in a useful article in The Weekly Standard on April 29, have subsequently cast doubt on the disgruntled- scientist hypothesis, and an FBI spokesman said in May that the bureau, far from being "convinced" that the attacks were carried out by an American loner, had "not precluded any category of suspect, motive, or theory."
If anything, hints that anthrax and Al Qaeda may be linked have grown harder to dismiss. Dot one: Several of the hijackers, including their suspected ringleader, Mohamed Atta, are reported to have looked at crop dusters in Belle Glade, Fla. Dot two: Among five targeted media organizations, only one was not nationally prominent -- American Media, of Boca Raton, Fla., which happens to be a few miles from where Atta and other terrorists lived and attended flight school. (Atta rented an apartment from a real estate agent whose husband worked for American Media.) Dot three: In March a doctor in Fort Lauderdale announced that he had treated one of the terrorists for what, in retrospect, he believes was cutaneous anthrax. Doctors at Johns Hopkins University examined the case and concurred that anthrax was "the most probable and coherent interpretation of the data available."
Other recent reports cite captured documents and an unfinished lab in Afghanistan that suggest Al Qaeda was interested -- as presumably it would be -- in producing biological weapons, including anthrax. In 1999, an Arabic-language newspaper in London reported that "elements loyal to [Osama] bin Laden" had, for a few thousand dollars, "managed to obtain an offer for the supply of samples of anthrax and other poisons" from a former Soviet bloc country.
None of that proves anything. The FBI checked the 9/11 terrorists' homes, cars, and personal effects for anthrax. "Exhaustive testing did not support that anthrax was present anywhere the hijackers had been," an FBI spokesman told The New York Times in March.
A point worth noting: The anthrax-laced letters were all mailed after the deaths of Atta and his fellow hijackers. If Al Qaeda did have something to do with the anthrax attacks, whoever did the mailings is still out there.
The material. In April, news reports said that the material used in the attacks was not only "weaponized" but also more sophisticated than anything that U.S. military labs had managed to produce. In May, other news reports said that the material was (in The Times' words) "far less than weapons grade." Good grief. What's the story?
Everyone agrees that all of the anthrax was of the same type, known as the Ames strain. Most sources also agree that the first mailing, to the media organizations, contained a cruder formulation than the second, to Sens. Thomas A. Daschle, D-S.D., and Patrick Leahy, D-Vt. They also concur that the second batch was of impressive purity and concentration. "Very, very pure" is how Matthew Meselson, a Harvard University biologist who has looked at images of the material, described it in an interview. "If you look at it under the electron microscope, you don't see anything but anthrax spores." A cruder preparation, by contrast, would contain so-called vegetative cells and other debris.
One source of ultra-pure anthrax might be a foreign bio-weapons program. An obvious suspect: the former Soviet Union. The Soviets had as many as 2,000 scientists working on anthrax, Tell writes. In 1979, dozens, or hundreds, of Russians died when anthrax leaked from a bio-weapons facility in Sverdlovsk. Subsequent analyses found four or more different anthrax strains in tissue samples taken from the victims.
So does the material used in America last year look Soviet? No, says Ken Alibek, a former Soviet bio-weapons official who is now executive director of the George Mason University Center for Biodefense. He has reviewed images of the material and says it looks like nothing he saw in the Soviet Union. The material, in fact, is of mediocre quality, he told me, and was not produced industrially. It definitely had not been milled, nor did it appear to have any sort of coating to reduce static or otherwise enhance its deadliness. Silica supposedly found in the material, Alibek thinks, may simply be a residue from an unsophisticated drying process. Meselson concurs that the anthrax evinces no sign of special coating or processing. "There is no evidence that I know of," he told me, "that it was treated in any special way."
What about Iraq? It is known to have produced several thousand gallons of anthrax, but that was in liquid form. Stephen D. Bryen, who headed the Pentagon's Defense Technology Security Administration during the Reagan administration and who now is the managing partner of Aurora Defense, says that United Nations inspectors in Iraq found no "dusty" anthrax (the dry, wafting variety used in the U.S. attacks) -- which of course could mean either that the Iraqis didn't (yet) have it or that they hid it well. Bryen also notes that the Iraqis, like the Soviets, tend to mix together various germs (or strains) and chemicals in their weapons, presumably to defeat countermeasures. The U.S. anthrax was all of a single strain.
If the U.S. anthrax was very pure but not specially weaponized, could it have been made by amateurs? In small quantities, yes, according to both Alibek and Meselson. It could be done, Alibek says, with "a very simple, nonindustrial process -- a very primitive process -- that could let you get a trillion spores in one gram. You can't make hundreds of kilos, but you could make hundreds of grams at this concentration."
Meselson concurs. "It's something that could be done by a fair number of people." The necessary glassware, culturing media, centrifuges, and so on "would exist in a large number of places, both hospitals and laboratories -- widespread."
The U.S. attacks, Meselson notes, confirmed what a Canadian simulation had already shown: Even uncoated, nonindustrial-grade anthrax easily suspends itself in the air, floating around and penetrating lungs. No special coating or treatment is necessary. Whoever produced the few grams used last year could presumably produce more. Not enough to fill a crop duster, perhaps, but enough to kill a lot of people.
The outlook. So what to assume? Bryen notes that dropping anthrax in the mail was a very primitive way to distribute it. "It's not how regimes think about dispersing a biological or chemical weapon," he said. "Which should say that the guy distributing it was a total amateur." That, in turn, argues for what Bryen calls the "sample" theory. "The sample theory being that somebody gave these guys a small amount. It has all the characteristics that it was given to people who didn't have any idea how to use it."
Or maybe, on the other hand, not. Paul Ewald, a biologist at Amherst College and the author of Plague Time: The New Germ Theory of Disease, suggests that inefficient distribution might have been exactly the point. "If this attack was caused by the Al Qaeda group -- and I think that's the best explanation, given the evidence available -- this small release would be most useful as a demonstration that they have anthrax on U.S. soil."
If the terrorists are dumb, Ewald says, they made or obtained a few grams of anthrax and mailed off their whole supply. "We'd be wiser if we planned for the smart-terrorist possibility," he says. Smart terrorists would have made or obtained larger quantities of the stuff and stashed it, probably (if they're smart) before setting off alarms by sending out a few grams. Later, with the potency of their weapon proved, they could mount, or threaten to mount, a much larger attack.
Ewald argues for a policy that assumes this is what's going on and that urgently enlists the public's eyes and ears and memories. "We should be alerting people to let authorities know of any suspicious activity they may have seen that would relate to people hiding canisters or objects or doing something that didn't look right," Ewald says. The question is not whether Ewald is right, but whether we want to bet he is wrong.
One other thing. When did info about the 9/11 terrorists start coming out? What I am getting at is the letter that was mailed to American Media in Fl. Everyone wonders why the mailer would have chosen that media outlet. The "common" thought is that it was to "frame" the terrorists. But the letters went out a week to the day after 9/11. So the mailer, in order to frame them, would have had to know where they were from, and then researched what media source was closest. Did he have 6 days to do it? Or 2 days? Or was the info not even public a week after 9/11? Was it sheer coincidence that the anthrax mailer chose to send letters to the BIG news outlets, and the company that spits out tabloid rags? If the mailer wanted to hit the tabloid audience, why didn't he send the letter directly to the National Enquirer?
Note: I started to highlight the relevant parts, and it is ALL relevant!
__________________________
Does Al Qaeda Have Anthrax? Better Assume So
National Journal, June 1, 2002
By Jonathan Rauch
The operatives and allies of Al Qaeda have something in mind for the United States, of that there can be little doubt. Something nasty. Vice President Dick Cheney said in May it is "almost certain" that the terrorists will strike again. Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld warned that terrorists "inevitably" will get their hands on weapons of mass destruction, "and they would not hesitate one minute to use them." Question: What if they already did use them and are preparing to do so again? Were last year's anthrax attacks, which caused five fatalities, a preview?
No one knows, of course. That said, there are dots worth connecting.
The perpetrator(s). In November, the FBI issued a suspect profile identifying the likely anthrax attacker as a single adult male, probably an American with a scientific background, lab experience, poor social skills, and a grudge. Some people -- I was one of them -- viewed this interpretation with skepticism. What would be the motive? Why the timing so close to September 11? A number of analysts, including David Tell in a useful article in The Weekly Standard on April 29, have subsequently cast doubt on the disgruntled- scientist hypothesis, and an FBI spokesman said in May that the bureau, far from being "convinced" that the attacks were carried out by an American loner, had "not precluded any category of suspect, motive, or theory."
If anything, hints that anthrax and Al Qaeda may be linked have grown harder to dismiss. Dot one: Several of the hijackers, including their suspected ringleader, Mohamed Atta, are reported to have looked at crop dusters in Belle Glade, Fla. Dot two: Among five targeted media organizations, only one was not nationally prominent -- American Media, of Boca Raton, Fla., which happens to be a few miles from where Atta and other terrorists lived and attended flight school. (Atta rented an apartment from a real estate agent whose husband worked for American Media.) Dot three: In March a doctor in Fort Lauderdale announced that he had treated one of the terrorists for what, in retrospect, he believes was cutaneous anthrax. Doctors at Johns Hopkins University examined the case and concurred that anthrax was "the most probable and coherent interpretation of the data available."
Other recent reports cite captured documents and an unfinished lab in Afghanistan that suggest Al Qaeda was interested -- as presumably it would be -- in producing biological weapons, including anthrax. In 1999, an Arabic-language newspaper in London reported that "elements loyal to [Osama] bin Laden" had, for a few thousand dollars, "managed to obtain an offer for the supply of samples of anthrax and other poisons" from a former Soviet bloc country.
None of that proves anything. The FBI checked the 9/11 terrorists' homes, cars, and personal effects for anthrax. "Exhaustive testing did not support that anthrax was present anywhere the hijackers had been," an FBI spokesman told The New York Times in March.
A point worth noting: The anthrax-laced letters were all mailed after the deaths of Atta and his fellow hijackers. If Al Qaeda did have something to do with the anthrax attacks, whoever did the mailings is still out there.
The material. In April, news reports said that the material used in the attacks was not only "weaponized" but also more sophisticated than anything that U.S. military labs had managed to produce. In May, other news reports said that the material was (in The Times' words) "far less than weapons grade." Good grief. What's the story?
Everyone agrees that all of the anthrax was of the same type, known as the Ames strain. Most sources also agree that the first mailing, to the media organizations, contained a cruder formulation than the second, to Sens. Thomas A. Daschle, D-S.D., and Patrick Leahy, D-Vt. They also concur that the second batch was of impressive purity and concentration. "Very, very pure" is how Matthew Meselson, a Harvard University biologist who has looked at images of the material, described it in an interview. "If you look at it under the electron microscope, you don't see anything but anthrax spores." A cruder preparation, by contrast, would contain so-called vegetative cells and other debris.
One source of ultra-pure anthrax might be a foreign bio-weapons program. An obvious suspect: the former Soviet Union. The Soviets had as many as 2,000 scientists working on anthrax, Tell writes. In 1979, dozens, or hundreds, of Russians died when anthrax leaked from a bio-weapons facility in Sverdlovsk. Subsequent analyses found four or more different anthrax strains in tissue samples taken from the victims.
So does the material used in America last year look Soviet? No, says Ken Alibek, a former Soviet bio-weapons official who is now executive director of the George Mason University Center for Biodefense. He has reviewed images of the material and says it looks like nothing he saw in the Soviet Union. The material, in fact, is of mediocre quality, he told me, and was not produced industrially. It definitely had not been milled, nor did it appear to have any sort of coating to reduce static or otherwise enhance its deadliness. Silica supposedly found in the material, Alibek thinks, may simply be a residue from an unsophisticated drying process. Meselson concurs that the anthrax evinces no sign of special coating or processing. "There is no evidence that I know of," he told me, "that it was treated in any special way."
What about Iraq? It is known to have produced several thousand gallons of anthrax, but that was in liquid form. Stephen D. Bryen, who headed the Pentagon's Defense Technology Security Administration during the Reagan administration and who now is the managing partner of Aurora Defense, says that United Nations inspectors in Iraq found no "dusty" anthrax (the dry, wafting variety used in the U.S. attacks) -- which of course could mean either that the Iraqis didn't (yet) have it or that they hid it well. Bryen also notes that the Iraqis, like the Soviets, tend to mix together various germs (or strains) and chemicals in their weapons, presumably to defeat countermeasures. The U.S. anthrax was all of a single strain.
If the U.S. anthrax was very pure but not specially weaponized, could it have been made by amateurs? In small quantities, yes, according to both Alibek and Meselson. It could be done, Alibek says, with "a very simple, nonindustrial process -- a very primitive process -- that could let you get a trillion spores in one gram. You can't make hundreds of kilos, but you could make hundreds of grams at this concentration."
Meselson concurs. "It's something that could be done by a fair number of people." The necessary glassware, culturing media, centrifuges, and so on "would exist in a large number of places, both hospitals and laboratories -- widespread."
The U.S. attacks, Meselson notes, confirmed what a Canadian simulation had already shown: Even uncoated, nonindustrial-grade anthrax easily suspends itself in the air, floating around and penetrating lungs. No special coating or treatment is necessary. Whoever produced the few grams used last year could presumably produce more. Not enough to fill a crop duster, perhaps, but enough to kill a lot of people.
The outlook. So what to assume? Bryen notes that dropping anthrax in the mail was a very primitive way to distribute it. "It's not how regimes think about dispersing a biological or chemical weapon," he said. "Which should say that the guy distributing it was a total amateur." That, in turn, argues for what Bryen calls the "sample" theory. "The sample theory being that somebody gave these guys a small amount. It has all the characteristics that it was given to people who didn't have any idea how to use it."
Or maybe, on the other hand, not. Paul Ewald, a biologist at Amherst College and the author of Plague Time: The New Germ Theory of Disease, suggests that inefficient distribution might have been exactly the point. "If this attack was caused by the Al Qaeda group -- and I think that's the best explanation, given the evidence available -- this small release would be most useful as a demonstration that they have anthrax on U.S. soil."
If the terrorists are dumb, Ewald says, they made or obtained a few grams of anthrax and mailed off their whole supply. "We'd be wiser if we planned for the smart-terrorist possibility," he says. Smart terrorists would have made or obtained larger quantities of the stuff and stashed it, probably (if they're smart) before setting off alarms by sending out a few grams. Later, with the potency of their weapon proved, they could mount, or threaten to mount, a much larger attack.
Ewald argues for a policy that assumes this is what's going on and that urgently enlists the public's eyes and ears and memories. "We should be alerting people to let authorities know of any suspicious activity they may have seen that would relate to people hiding canisters or objects or doing something that didn't look right," Ewald says. The question is not whether Ewald is right, but whether we want to bet he is wrong.
ADMIN EDITORIAL - Attorneys say guilty verdict unlikely FNP 08/10/08
I think the DNA evidence would be impeachable, almost without a doubt. The "science" of microbial forensics was created specifically for this case (completed in June of 2003 - American Academy of Microbiology - Abigail A. Salyers) with the goal of giving the science "legitimacy", specifically so it would not be blown out of court when they finally found a suspect. Ms. Salyers is on the record as saying this.
Regardless, assuming that the concepts and the evidence chain is believable (and that is open to doubt, as at least SOME of it was contaminated by bleach during one of the initial tests), they would still have to prove that the DNA could only have come from that vial. And the very basis they are using to "explain" the DNA, would open the possibility that the same DNA was elsewhere. (Some of the spores are basically clones of each other, which is where the DNA match is made - so who is to say that those clones were not removed by someone ELSE and grown/re-cloned?)
And, it ultimately still comes down to the fact that it would be impossible to isolate Dr. Ivins as the only person who could have accessed that vial. The internal security was almost nil in the lab at that time. (External security was good - so people couldn't get IN, but what happened once they were in the lab was basically unchecked).
So, it basically is just at a standstill. They are "pretty" sure the anthrax came from that vial, Ivins had access to it (along with a dozen other people), and Ivins was a bit strange.
Now - here's a quick list of what would blow it out of the water - the envelopes did NOT come from the Frederick PO. They came from Elkton MD or one of two locations in VA; Ivins could almost certainly NOT have been in NJ to mail the letters; Ivins had no motive; and Ivin's mental illness seems to have been seriously exaggarated by the investigators. They apparently fed information from accusers to an unlicenced "therapist" who then, working with the FBI, used her ill-gotten information to stamp a seal of legitimacy on the claims.
Unless there is a whole lot more that they haven't told us (and there doesn't seem to be) the only people who would have possibly voted "guilty" on a jury would be people who have already decided that Ivins is guilty, and refuse to change their mind, no matter what. Hopefully the defense would have striken them off the jury, pronto. but, honestly, I doubt seriously that the Grand Jury would have indicted Ivins in the first place. We will never know now.
Regardless, assuming that the concepts and the evidence chain is believable (and that is open to doubt, as at least SOME of it was contaminated by bleach during one of the initial tests), they would still have to prove that the DNA could only have come from that vial. And the very basis they are using to "explain" the DNA, would open the possibility that the same DNA was elsewhere. (Some of the spores are basically clones of each other, which is where the DNA match is made - so who is to say that those clones were not removed by someone ELSE and grown/re-cloned?)
And, it ultimately still comes down to the fact that it would be impossible to isolate Dr. Ivins as the only person who could have accessed that vial. The internal security was almost nil in the lab at that time. (External security was good - so people couldn't get IN, but what happened once they were in the lab was basically unchecked).
So, it basically is just at a standstill. They are "pretty" sure the anthrax came from that vial, Ivins had access to it (along with a dozen other people), and Ivins was a bit strange.
Now - here's a quick list of what would blow it out of the water - the envelopes did NOT come from the Frederick PO. They came from Elkton MD or one of two locations in VA; Ivins could almost certainly NOT have been in NJ to mail the letters; Ivins had no motive; and Ivin's mental illness seems to have been seriously exaggarated by the investigators. They apparently fed information from accusers to an unlicenced "therapist" who then, working with the FBI, used her ill-gotten information to stamp a seal of legitimacy on the claims.
Unless there is a whole lot more that they haven't told us (and there doesn't seem to be) the only people who would have possibly voted "guilty" on a jury would be people who have already decided that Ivins is guilty, and refuse to change their mind, no matter what. Hopefully the defense would have striken them off the jury, pronto. but, honestly, I doubt seriously that the Grand Jury would have indicted Ivins in the first place. We will never know now.
Saturday, August 9, 2008
absurd! The fake names scandal
tsg http://www.thesmokinggun.com/archive/years/2008/0806081anthrax7.html has yet another copy of the new & improved search warrant information.
I was trying to grasp what the deal was with Dr. Ivins email addresses and so-called fake names. I am still trying to absorb it all but it is crazy that this is considered any sort of evidence against him. And frankly, it had NOTHING to do with anthrax, or terrorism, or anything. It is simply an invasion of his privacy by authorities who were on a witch hunt!
OK - on TSG - start at page 6. Ivins created an email address of Jimmyflathead, and listed his name as Ed Irving. That would be suspicious except he didn't do anything bad with it! Not only that, but the emails he sent out from that address actually listed his name as Bruce Ivins. So WHAT? I have several email accounts. I don't know that I have ever used a FALSE name, but I have shortened my name, used the wrong DOB and such before. It's not sinister. I don't want a lot of spam on my main email account, so I created a new one to put on cookie sites and such.
Ivins used the Jimmyflathead account to play on Wikipedia. He said derogatory things about that sorority Kappa Kappa Gamma (KKG) on Wiki. He got into edit wars about KKG on Wiki. So What? He knew alot about KKG. So what? I know a lot about many things. And, if I don't know, I sometimes spend a lot of time learning. (Like about this whole anthrax case). he apparently knew some stuff that was "secret". SO WHAT? My God - it's a freaking sorority, not some top-secret military strategy! And, as additional proof of Ivin's diabolical mind - he actually encouraged people on Wiki to email him. That is just NOT DONE! If you ever edit on Wiki, you must never discuss anything in private with other posters. Sheesh.
I swear, it sounds like middle-school dramatics! I CANNOT believe our GOVERNMENT is involved in this kind of crap.
OK.. the next email address evidence has been heavily redacted, but it seems like it is referring to the fact that he once lived on the same street as the woman from KKG who now says that he was stalking her. There was an incident of VANDALISM!!! Ivins might have done it, but denied it. Since when is the FBI investigating 20 year old graffiti cases? Hello???
The next information is even crazier! Ivins rented a PO box to hide his identity as he traded in illicit porn. No? Not porn? OMG! He was selling that TOP SECRET KKG information! And he claimed that he had STOLEN IT from the sorority house in college! No wonder the FBI is involved! The CIA and Interpol should be notified too.
The document goes on to show how deeply entrenched Ivins was in the secret ways of the KKG. I'm sorry. Maybe I don't get it. But a sorority is just a bunch of snobby girls right? Is there some reason that he was not entitled to either 1) love or 2) hate the KKG?
I'm kidding. I really know why the FBI spent so much time on this KKG "obsession" that Ivins so clearly had. The anthrax was mailed from a blue mailbox. In NJ. In Princeton NJ. That's a college town, you know? And this actual mailbox was 100 yards from the KKG storage house on campus. Not a sorority house. Just a place they stored all their sorority snob shit. So clearly, Ivin's obsession with KKG was the impetus for driving up there to drop off the poison.
By the way FBI guys, I actually thought of a BETTER link for Ivins and Princeton, but it seems to have slipped right by you guys. Did you know that his DAD was a graduate of Princeton? But I guess no one in their right mind would ever give that connection an iota of credit, so you came up with the sorority chick thing. Holy cow.
This is an embarassment. seriously. But not only that, it is a tragedy. Ivins is dead - almost certainly a legally, and most likely a factually, innocent man. And the FBI is trying to sell us this propaganda as evidence. They are just letting the apparent suicide speak for itself. because at least half the viewing audience will think "he must be guilty if he killed himself". The rest of us are not so dense and can envision the torment the guy was living when the walls came crushing down on him - in the form of a greedy, lying therapist.
I was trying to grasp what the deal was with Dr. Ivins email addresses and so-called fake names. I am still trying to absorb it all but it is crazy that this is considered any sort of evidence against him. And frankly, it had NOTHING to do with anthrax, or terrorism, or anything. It is simply an invasion of his privacy by authorities who were on a witch hunt!
OK - on TSG - start at page 6. Ivins created an email address of Jimmyflathead, and listed his name as Ed Irving. That would be suspicious except he didn't do anything bad with it! Not only that, but the emails he sent out from that address actually listed his name as Bruce Ivins. So WHAT? I have several email accounts. I don't know that I have ever used a FALSE name, but I have shortened my name, used the wrong DOB and such before. It's not sinister. I don't want a lot of spam on my main email account, so I created a new one to put on cookie sites and such.
Ivins used the Jimmyflathead account to play on Wikipedia. He said derogatory things about that sorority Kappa Kappa Gamma (KKG) on Wiki. He got into edit wars about KKG on Wiki. So What? He knew alot about KKG. So what? I know a lot about many things. And, if I don't know, I sometimes spend a lot of time learning. (Like about this whole anthrax case). he apparently knew some stuff that was "secret". SO WHAT? My God - it's a freaking sorority, not some top-secret military strategy! And, as additional proof of Ivin's diabolical mind - he actually encouraged people on Wiki to email him. That is just NOT DONE! If you ever edit on Wiki, you must never discuss anything in private with other posters. Sheesh.
I swear, it sounds like middle-school dramatics! I CANNOT believe our GOVERNMENT is involved in this kind of crap.
OK.. the next email address evidence has been heavily redacted, but it seems like it is referring to the fact that he once lived on the same street as the woman from KKG who now says that he was stalking her. There was an incident of VANDALISM!!! Ivins might have done it, but denied it. Since when is the FBI investigating 20 year old graffiti cases? Hello???
The next information is even crazier! Ivins rented a PO box to hide his identity as he traded in illicit porn. No? Not porn? OMG! He was selling that TOP SECRET KKG information! And he claimed that he had STOLEN IT from the sorority house in college! No wonder the FBI is involved! The CIA and Interpol should be notified too.
The document goes on to show how deeply entrenched Ivins was in the secret ways of the KKG. I'm sorry. Maybe I don't get it. But a sorority is just a bunch of snobby girls right? Is there some reason that he was not entitled to either 1) love or 2) hate the KKG?
I'm kidding. I really know why the FBI spent so much time on this KKG "obsession" that Ivins so clearly had. The anthrax was mailed from a blue mailbox. In NJ. In Princeton NJ. That's a college town, you know? And this actual mailbox was 100 yards from the KKG storage house on campus. Not a sorority house. Just a place they stored all their sorority snob shit. So clearly, Ivin's obsession with KKG was the impetus for driving up there to drop off the poison.
By the way FBI guys, I actually thought of a BETTER link for Ivins and Princeton, but it seems to have slipped right by you guys. Did you know that his DAD was a graduate of Princeton? But I guess no one in their right mind would ever give that connection an iota of credit, so you came up with the sorority chick thing. Holy cow.
This is an embarassment. seriously. But not only that, it is a tragedy. Ivins is dead - almost certainly a legally, and most likely a factually, innocent man. And the FBI is trying to sell us this propaganda as evidence. They are just letting the apparent suicide speak for itself. because at least half the viewing audience will think "he must be guilty if he killed himself". The rest of us are not so dense and can envision the torment the guy was living when the walls came crushing down on him - in the form of a greedy, lying therapist.
Memorial Service AP 08/09/08
Ivins remembered for intelligence, compassion
By BRIAN WITTE, Associated Press Writer2 hours, 29 minutes ago
The Army scientist suspected in the anthrax attacks was remembered for his humor, intelligence and compassion at a memorial service Saturday.
Bruce Ivins, 62, died of an apparent suicide late last month after being informed by the FBI that charges likely were being brought against him in connection with the 2001 attacks.
Some mourners wept when speakers at the service talked about Ivins' many hobbies, including juggling, target shooting, practical jokes, cartoons and the weather. Colleagues recalled a talented scientist with a probing mind who loved to debate a wide variety of subjects.
"Bruce was many a thing," said one of his brothers, Charles Ivins, who added that he took some solace in knowing that Bruce's "torment" had ended.
Bruce Ivins also was remembered as a devoted musician at St. John's the Evangelist Roman Catholic Church, where he played piano for 28 years and was known to volunteer to clean up after services.
More than 250 people attended the hourlong service. Speakers cited the turnout as evidence of how important Ivins was to the church community.
Some people who knew Ivins have said they cannot believe the scientist who liked to work in his garden and volunteer for the American Red Cross was capable of bioterrorism that killed five people, sickened 17 and scared the nation a month after the Sept. 11 attacks.
John Barnard, who worked with Ivins at the U.S. Army Medical Research Institute of Infectious Diseases at Fort Detrick between 1992 and 1994, said he does not believe the government's claims. He said he has written to several members of Congress asking for an inquiry.
"My experience of him during that time is that he was a very loving, giving man, and this doesn't make sense at all," said Barnard, who now lives in Pittsburgh.
Kathleen O'Connor, who met Ivins at a dinner while the two volunteered for the Red Cross, also said she could not believe a man who gave so much of his time to help the community could do something so terrible.
"They haven't got a real case. It's all circumstantial," O'Connor said after the service. "There's just no way he could do it. ... They just grabbed a convenient person."
In the days since his death July 29, friends have recalled his musical skills and eccentric personality as a startling contrast to the dangerously psychotic person described by federal investigators.
Authorities believe Ivins mailed deadly anthrax spores in letters, including ones sent to members of Congress. By 2005, government scientists genetically matched anthrax in his laboratory at Fort Detrick to the fatal toxin. Federal authorities also focused on Ivins' history of paranoia and delusional thinking that prompted doctors to medicate him.
The Justice Department says it could have convicted Ivins, a microbiologist and anthrax vaccine expert who spent 35 years working at the bioweapons lab. Ivins' lawyer, Paul F. Kemp, has disagreed, contending that because it took the government so long to act, its evidence must have been weak.
Co-workers and Ivins' family held a private memorial service Wednesday at Fort Detrick's nondenominational chapel. Frederick is a city of about 58,000 people, 40 miles northeast of Washington.
Ivins is survived by his wife, Diane; a son, Andy; a daughter, Amanda, and brothers Tom Ivins of Middletown, Ohio, and Charles Ivins of Etowah, N.C.
By BRIAN WITTE, Associated Press Writer2 hours, 29 minutes ago
The Army scientist suspected in the anthrax attacks was remembered for his humor, intelligence and compassion at a memorial service Saturday.
Bruce Ivins, 62, died of an apparent suicide late last month after being informed by the FBI that charges likely were being brought against him in connection with the 2001 attacks.
Some mourners wept when speakers at the service talked about Ivins' many hobbies, including juggling, target shooting, practical jokes, cartoons and the weather. Colleagues recalled a talented scientist with a probing mind who loved to debate a wide variety of subjects.
"Bruce was many a thing," said one of his brothers, Charles Ivins, who added that he took some solace in knowing that Bruce's "torment" had ended.
Bruce Ivins also was remembered as a devoted musician at St. John's the Evangelist Roman Catholic Church, where he played piano for 28 years and was known to volunteer to clean up after services.
More than 250 people attended the hourlong service. Speakers cited the turnout as evidence of how important Ivins was to the church community.
Some people who knew Ivins have said they cannot believe the scientist who liked to work in his garden and volunteer for the American Red Cross was capable of bioterrorism that killed five people, sickened 17 and scared the nation a month after the Sept. 11 attacks.
John Barnard, who worked with Ivins at the U.S. Army Medical Research Institute of Infectious Diseases at Fort Detrick between 1992 and 1994, said he does not believe the government's claims. He said he has written to several members of Congress asking for an inquiry.
"My experience of him during that time is that he was a very loving, giving man, and this doesn't make sense at all," said Barnard, who now lives in Pittsburgh.
Kathleen O'Connor, who met Ivins at a dinner while the two volunteered for the Red Cross, also said she could not believe a man who gave so much of his time to help the community could do something so terrible.
"They haven't got a real case. It's all circumstantial," O'Connor said after the service. "There's just no way he could do it. ... They just grabbed a convenient person."
In the days since his death July 29, friends have recalled his musical skills and eccentric personality as a startling contrast to the dangerously psychotic person described by federal investigators.
Authorities believe Ivins mailed deadly anthrax spores in letters, including ones sent to members of Congress. By 2005, government scientists genetically matched anthrax in his laboratory at Fort Detrick to the fatal toxin. Federal authorities also focused on Ivins' history of paranoia and delusional thinking that prompted doctors to medicate him.
The Justice Department says it could have convicted Ivins, a microbiologist and anthrax vaccine expert who spent 35 years working at the bioweapons lab. Ivins' lawyer, Paul F. Kemp, has disagreed, contending that because it took the government so long to act, its evidence must have been weak.
Co-workers and Ivins' family held a private memorial service Wednesday at Fort Detrick's nondenominational chapel. Frederick is a city of about 58,000 people, 40 miles northeast of Washington.
Ivins is survived by his wife, Diane; a son, Andy; a daughter, Amanda, and brothers Tom Ivins of Middletown, Ohio, and Charles Ivins of Etowah, N.C.
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